From the makers of Pedigree Dogs Exposed, the latest news and views regarding inherited disorders and conformation issues in purebred dogs.
Hmm very interesting. Some good points but very poor argument by breeders that say "that is the breed", "clumbers have red eyes".
I was taken aback at the comment "clumbers have red eyes" as if that's perfectly natural. The sheer arrogance from the breeders though and the contempt that they have for the veterinary profession speaks volumes.
I feel sorry for the owner if they have done all the checks but if its eyes are sore , they are sore. the vet cant ignore what he has been told to look for ( incidently has anyone complained that the vet let a sick dog pass ? thought not ) I have always speyed and neutered my favorite dogs for having health problems but instead I will make a new breed, heart murmers ,loose pattella, elbow displacia and wry mouths are breed traits ( hey i've already been told by the top breeder that epilepsy and wry mouths are normal so i'm not far off)Anyone who complains will be told it is traditional and part of the breed.Most of my dogs over the last 25 years have been that way so how dare they tell me I am wrong.and the short lifespan means they are less responsability, who wants the burden of a dog living over 10 yearsI've had to sacrifice some fantastic personality's on health grounds , I'd have loved a line going back to my favorite dogs , but for some reason that would be wrong but breeding from dogs who have health problems but that have won prizes is ok
Dear Anon. Thank you for "I have always speyed [sic] and neutered my favorite dogs for having health problems." That is what good stewards of our breeds do—make sacrifices for the good of the breed. We owe them more than winning.
I'm interested to see where this would go. If they would go to shows and win and drop out so they dont have to do the vet check and not go on. Or what if they all decide to just not show up and there are no Clumbers
Why isn't More4 covering this. The likes of Dog World are making the broadcast coverage look slow and dim-witted. More4 is sitting on top of a huge news story (ok huge in the world of dogs) and yet seem insistant on just running their rather lackluster programme as prepared. Is there no one on More4 with a nose for a story or are they constrained by their contractural relationship with the Kennel Club??
The comments on that video are just unbelievable.What's wrong with people?Finally the KC is doing something that might very well be a big step in the right direction."Oh poor me, I cannot get fancy titles for breeding diseased animals, now I'm never going to this awful place again!"They are acting like children.
The CC stands for this bitch. She was just unable to represent the breed in the group.
Frida were you there, did you see it for yourself?NO then shut up !!!
It would really have been far more sensible for dogs to have been vet tested before even entering the show ring. Stupid Kennel Club. The way they have gone about it was bound to get peoples' backs up.
Ahhhh but had they done that, they would have 1) eliminated several breeds from showing at all -remember the DQ'd dogs were BOB so logically if they failed, every other dog would have failed. 2) with the loss of 6 breeds they would have lost revenue, and even more, they would have lost the ability to point fingers at breeds and breeders that certain people don't like or understand. This is not to say that unhealthy dogs should be allowed in the ring, and certainly should never win, but there are traits far more unhealthy that are not being checked for, and the eyes of certain breeds do droop without it indicating a medical issue. If the KC is really interested in healthy dogs only, then every dog entered should be required to produce records of good health including joint xrays, clear eye exam, etc.
I find it absurd that she's listing the show results and "popularity" of dogs and "all the breeders know/love this bitch" as reasons why she "cannot understand". "Clumbers have red eyes" because they can't frickin close them. Although I must say, I've seen much MUCH worse eyes on a Clumber than this bitch has. Her eyes look fairly tight in that video. Now I did say "fairly".I was pretty nauseated at the "slits for eyes, little Chinese eyes" remark, incidentally. I was unable to view the last 3 mins due to YouTube having a hissy fit so goodness knows what other gems that woman came out with.
This breed is a tain wreck for numerous health problems and temperment issues. There probaly aren't any that could pass this close an evalution so maybe the breed should be taken out of the stud books.
People and (some) vets don't even realize the hard work and dedication it takes to breed dogs, I really feel sorry for the owner.
I think when she refers to Clumbers as having red eyes, she is talking about the skin pigment in relationship to the coat color -- a lot of dogs with that sort of coloration appear to have red eyes, noses, etc. I don't think she means the whites of the eyes are unnaturally red. Just my humble opinion, hopefully there is room for more than one opinion in here.
Really fascinating interviews. I'm not where the interviewer stands- and I like that.According to the owner, the bitch wasn't noted for ectropion, she was noted for eye inflammation, or conjunctivitis, and she got red/inflamed eyes because she had a couple of trots around the ring under very hot/bright lights that day prior to it's vet check.It's a retrieving spaniel. Does that mean it can't work outside when it's sunny and over 50 degrees?Forget about work. What about play? Assume they're beloved as pets. You can't play outside on a sunny warm day w/out it's eyes becoming irritated/inflamed? Sorry kids, it's sunny outside, please don't take out the Clumber Spaniel out while you play catch- it's tough on her eyes. The owner is saying a couple of hours and a couple of trots under hot bright lights naturally enflame /redden the eyes. Maybe rethink needing haws on your breed, no? The fact that many judges and "vets" approved of her eyes prior to disqualification is not a ringing endorsement. It's a sad comment on the degree of disfunction in the show world all around. Rachel
Your just taking the piss, u havent got a clue..!!
I'm with you, Rachel. This is a sporting breed. Just because a problem is widespread doesn't make it any the less a problem.
Re. Vet testing before entering the show ring. It is simply not realistic, far too many dogs. It would be too expensive, time consuming and because this would require many veterinarians, could possibly give slightly different results. Doing it this way with just one veterinarian testing those 15 BOB dogs, ensures that everyone gets the same treatment/judgement.
Then the cost should be included in a non-refundable entry fee. You pays your money you takes your chances. That would soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
She got it right, everyone else is crazy and only the KC is promoting healthy dogs. WAY TO GO KC!As for the suggestion that it is in ANY way an issue or a difficulty to FULLY health test every dog, what a load of crap.If you can't be bothered, don't show your dog. Frankly, if you can't be bothered, what business do you have breeding dogs? And who says we can't insist on both? Health checks and clearances before AND at the shows.For the record, I'm not talking about eye clearances and a quick hip xray either. I'm talking about full, comprehensive health testing tailored for each breed, along with an overall inspection by an approved veterinarian. Hell, let's make it into a TITLE. I mean, since titles are the only thing that seems to matter to the show circuit.Hooray for the KC, for Jemima, and everyone who EVER spoke about about this most heinous form of cruelty, breeding damaged, deformed, defective dogs.Keep it up, KC, and my next dog will be an English chap!
i do feel a degree of sympathy for the owners of all the dogs who failed - for anyone who shows, winning at crufts is something many aspire to and for the the first bunch of owners of disqualified dogs, it must be quite difficult to take - especially when the dogs have done well previously. however, something does need to be done to improve the health of many of our beloved breeds of dog and i was saddened to hear the owner deny that the dog failed for ectropion as im sure most of us by now have seen the photo of the vet certificate clearly stating ectropion as the reason it failed. however, that said - having seen many clumbers in my time i did think this bitch had pretty good eyes compared to many - yes they could be better, but there are certainly many with much worse eyes. i also think every bob winner should have a vet check as i was rather saddened to see that while the clumber failed as its one of the 15 high profile breeds, the lovely newfoundland that went best in group today had in my opinion eyes that were showing as much droop to the lower lids as the clumbers...so because that isnt a high profile breed it can go and win best in group with what appears to be exactly the same health issue...anyone else have any views on that???
Agreed.15 breeds is not only not enough - it's patently unfair.I mean, particularly if they're only screening for things that can be caught with the naked eye. This means that the vet in question simply has to give each dog a once over.I think a more appropriate course would be to screen every single dog (certainly every dog put up for any kind of recognition!) and put the "problem" breeds into a separate category that involves FULL screenings. The idea that ANY dog could be put up for ANY recognition with a visible medical issue is appalling - and if anything, this is highlighting the fact that this is indeed happening with regularity.
I agree with this comment re: all breeds being vet tested - and the Newfie's eyes. The only reason the high profile dogs are high profile is that the brakes weren't applied sooner
The interwiew is laughable. It doesn´t matter if the bitch is well known by judges and other breeders. It doesn´t matter if she has all clear on hips, ellbows and patella (correct me if I´m wrong on the healthtests) if the dogs eyes are bad. I don´t care if the dog is from a danish breeder. It doesn´t matter how good you are as a breeder. Some dogs get sick anyway.
Ectropian is not an illness.. the dog is not "sick' does not have a disease.. she has a fault.. do you wear glasses?? then you have a fault. are you teeth crooked? a fault.. do you feet turn in or out.. then you have a fault.. we all have them.. dogs do too
These issues targeted by The Kennel Club are more than a person needing glasses. These are dogs, not people, and one problem we seem to have with purebred dogs is overindentification. We are not our dogs. The purpose of showing is to reward the best breeding stock to preserve the breed. The "best" should not include animals with health issues that interfere with normal function.
I agree with the points Hanna makes.Plus the owner says she won't come to Crufts again.Good.The bitch can have a well earned rest.I don't agree with running all over the world just for a few bits of card.Glory for the owners.All breeds should be tested.
how do you know se is not'rested'?/ honestly people here are all experts on all things.. it is amazing you are not all running your own countries
You’re watching a good example of “The Emperor’s new clothes” syndrome in action. Someone thankfully has finally got up the courage to tell the breeders the plain truth, that their dogs are not up to standard, and have not made the grade required of a healthy dog. In short they have been rumbled..
They seem to have cut off the last two women being interviewed now?!
would like to say i saw this bitch on gundog she had very little Haw showing unlike the newfoundland whos were red, it wasnt red at all,
also miss harrison why does all these comments need to be approved is it to only put on what comments people agree with you about, WHY have you not had your flat coats eyes tested for glycoma the breed council would like all flat coats to get an idea of whats going around but i hear you refused, your just a looney leftie who needs to have a baby or get a man as you have some serious need to be loved issues
I would guess it’s less about getting approval, and more about the showcasing of poor manners and bad grammar.
better than being a bunch of looney lefty nutcases who really need to get a life in stead of picking on dog show people, i dont see you worring about puppy farms or the doodle breeds which have now got so many problems with aggression and health issues, so what will be next i wonder the grand national, or maybe you could start on the ferret people those poor poor rabbits, like i said you need to go do something important with your life, i wouldnt mind if you were going this for dog health but this is about bigging yourself and your looney lefty mates up, you had access to put a stop to puppy farms but you have just increased there popularity
I rest my case....
is the KC going to give the BOB to second place ?
I understand why the owner was upset but what possible motive would the vet have had for 'looking for a problem' just to fail the dog? Even from this clip I can see mild ectropion in the left eye and more sever ectropion giving a diamond eye appearance in the right eye. Of course running about in he warm dry air of Crufts irritated the dogs eyes.....because the eyelid conformation is not correct. Sadly this is otherwise a nice Cumber with much better conformation than many I have seen but not good enough to pass a vet check. That's sad, but it just means there is more work to do. Keep it up! Consider adding in some blood from the working Clumber stock. Loose eyes are not at all usefull in thick cover.VP (non Crufts vet!)