tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post154145263640234396..comments2024-03-20T17:32:35.238+00:00Comments on Pedigree Dogs Exposed - The Blog: Pugs. Let's face it.Jemima Harrisonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05092892697145388048noreply@blogger.comBlogger37125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-75998186605476593042016-08-28T17:32:55.804+01:002016-08-28T17:32:55.804+01:00I don't believe it is Ms. Harrison's goal ...I don't believe it is Ms. Harrison's goal with this educational crusade to wipe out "good, decent, and for the most part, honest people"...it is to provide the information necessary for said people to accept the best scientific evidence that brachycephalism in domestic dogs is unnatural for the species and causes welfare issues for no reason other than pedigree traditions and human aesthetics. Now tell me, do those good, decent, and mostly honest people value their status quo over the well-being of the dogs they produce? Then perhaps you need to rethink your description of them.Merriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12569399662021156149noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-30867655675714195852016-08-28T10:59:35.984+01:002016-08-28T10:59:35.984+01:00That's a heck of a lot of words. Especially gi...That's a heck of a lot of words. Especially given that I have not used the terms interchangeably - have merely pointed out that brachy dogs are predisposed to BOAS. <br /><br />Does being brachy guarantee breathing probs? Nope (and I've never said that). But the link is well established, with scientific paper after scientific paper elucidating it. Jemima Harrisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05092892697145388048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-80848341674179874422016-08-28T10:49:47.943+01:002016-08-28T10:49:47.943+01:00Pugs (and other breeds) by etiology, by nature, an...Pugs (and other breeds) by etiology, by nature, and yes, to some degree by nurture also, fall into a category of dog breeds most notably characterized by the term 'Brachycephalic', which is from the Greek meaning 'short' and 'head'. This would be in reference to the skull's shape and whether it was shorter THAN THAT WHICH IS USUAL FOR A SPECIFIC SPECIES, not BREED, SPECIES (species=canine, breed=pug, peke, etc.). Nowhere in any reputable reference material will it mention the words 'brachycephic' and 'breathing problems' in the same sentence, yet many supposedly well versed people toss those two words around like they're a popular dressing duo commonly used on a mixed green salad. They are not the same, do not have the same meaning, are not synonomous and are NEVER to be used interchangabley. EVER. The term brachycephalic merely refers to the scientific name tag given to various species in the world that fall within a certain range on the Cephalic Index, which is the ratio of the maximum width of the head of an organism (human or animal), multiplied by 100, divided by its maximum length in the horizontal plane, in other words, from the front to the back (in this case, of the head). It has absolutely nothing to do with whether an organism's breathing is going to be adequate enough to support its life expectancy, temperature restrictions, exercise regimen or respiratory function(s). It also cannot predict the next night's winning lottery numbers for you. THAT ISSUE (not the lottery one) is known as Brachycephlic S-Y-N-D-R-O-M-E or Brachycephalic Airway Syndrome!!! Two completely different diagnosis' entirely. Are they related? Possibly. Are they interchangeble terms meaning the same thing? Absolutely NOT. So please, the next time your little crusade to save the day gets your panties in a bunch and makes you feel like you need to wipe out an entire population of good, decent and, for the most part, honest people with your ignorant misrepresentation of the FACTS...PLEASE, DO YOUR RESEARCH FIRST AND FLING INSULTS AND ACCUSATIONS SECOND. I have a feeling that by judiciously doing the former you'll find no need for the latter thereby rendering this 'expose' entirely pointless, not to mention useless, senseless and all the other '-lesses' there happen to be in the human language as we currently understand it to be understood.Animals make me happy. You, not so much !!!https://www.blogger.com/profile/02378356820947124965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-26989928085780756162016-07-15T10:33:41.279+01:002016-07-15T10:33:41.279+01:00Excuse you? Are we comparing humans to dogs now? B...Excuse you? Are we comparing humans to dogs now? Because if so, I don't remember anyone ever selectively breeding human beings. That alone would be a highly immoral practice if applied to humans.<br /><br />However, IF that practice existed, and people were DELIBERATELY being bred with painful health complications that would restrict them and lower their quality of life, I think it's safe to say that most folks would want that practice to stop. That's not saying that people who HAVE disabilities should be eliminated... it's saying that if there is anything we can do to prevent health complications in the first place, we should definitely do that. Are you also offended by medical science and it's pursuit of solutions to medical problems? Because that's what this amounts to.<br /><br />The only thing anyone wants to eliminate is the practice of breeding defects into animals. With the result being that the pug as we know it would eventually cease to exist. It was never anything that nature intended in the first place... this article is just suggesting that humans reverse their irresponsible tampering with something else's genes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-45692519529316427942016-04-28T14:23:36.983+01:002016-04-28T14:23:36.983+01:00The retro pug/mop was developed by outbreeding pug...The retro pug/mop was developed by outbreeding pugs to the parsons russel terrier then breeding the offspring back to pug then breeding only the offspring with the longest muzzles together. Considering just how small the pugs gene pool was, this improves the breed in more than just one way. Of course the foolish breeders don't see it that way.Skyehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14845305990983021847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-17574080658051913562016-02-23T17:53:01.753+00:002016-02-23T17:53:01.753+00:00I think that what they are doing to pug is so so t...I think that what they are doing to pug is so so terrible that I will stop them my selfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-54861905932704151832016-02-15T02:45:30.876+00:002016-02-15T02:45:30.876+00:00If you had bothered to comprehend the purpose of t...If you had bothered to comprehend the purpose of this blog, you'd realize it argues that breeders should not breed from poorly conformed dogs in the first place. So, yes, their offspring should not exist because they should not have been created in the first place. <br /><br />Could be you think failing to breed an animal is the same as killing its offspring. (If so, you need help.)<br /><br />But no, I don't think that's what you're implying. You're going further than that, with your talk of a final, ermm, ultimate solution. <br /><br />Since you're evoking the Holocaust, please give examples where anyone on this blog says that poorly conformed dogs should be killed. <br /><br />While you're at it, google "Godwin's Law".Susanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00992106038865154885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-7655464181245198622015-12-29T20:53:08.948+00:002015-12-29T20:53:08.948+00:00I think part of the issue is people want "pur...I think part of the issue is people want "purebreeds", while these "retro pugs" aren't "pure" - they weren't created by pugs breeding with other pugs. No, these dogs were created by outbreeding pugs with another similar, but healthier breed of dog, and then breeding those offspring with other pugs/together to remove any "crossbreed" appearance.<br /><br />Unfortunately, "purebred" often means "inbred" now, and it would be very difficult to selectively find "purebred" pugs with the desired healthy build. Outbreeding is the quicker and more logical approach to dealing with such issues, but again, seems to be frowned upon with breeders.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-65520475713031712822015-12-14T13:08:40.283+00:002015-12-14T13:08:40.283+00:00So, what is your ultimate solution? They should no...So, what is your ultimate solution? They should not exist because they have health problems, is that what you're saying? Try to apply the same logic to people, and be ashamed of yourself, you fascist pig. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12609697463010182380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-69348251931155025372015-04-23T09:55:07.633+01:002015-04-23T09:55:07.633+01:00I have a long nose pug like the ones in the above ...I have a long nose pug like the ones in the above pic, I get asked frequently, what breed is he, when I tell them he is a pug they are shocked because he has a longer snout , also on a group site where u can post pics of your pugs and puglets, he has been called a mongrel because his nose isn't lflat enough, which made me question the fact is he or isn't he , even though he is a pedigree. So I started to reaserch and just found my answer thanks to the article above. 😊Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12486369890219891892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-77257186226592513812014-07-08T23:45:35.570+01:002014-07-08T23:45:35.570+01:00My family own a pedigree long nosed pug and I can ...My family own a pedigree long nosed pug and I can quite confidently say that her breathing is a whole lot easier due to the longer muzzle/ nose than it is if she had the classic I just ran into a brick wall looking muzzle which gives the decades old pugs their severe breathing problems.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01202725661486964297noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-89353674261777384992014-05-13T18:06:10.449+01:002014-05-13T18:06:10.449+01:00I just don't understand why breeders would bre...I just don't understand why breeders would breed traits that worsen the dogs health, why are those traits so desirable for shows and things? Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-91815526347854771922014-05-13T01:31:47.206+01:002014-05-13T01:31:47.206+01:00I have 2 flat faced Pugs, and neither of them have...I have 2 flat faced Pugs, and neither of them have ever had problems breathing. I looked for puppies with nice wide nostrils, and who's parents had never had any corrective surgery. The result is 2 perfectly healthy dogs that have never cost me a cent at the vet except for vaccinations.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-70302708652320216342014-01-13T05:42:08.551+00:002014-01-13T05:42:08.551+00:00As a long time pug owner and the issues that come ...As a long time pug owner and the issues that come with the flat face, I applaud any breeder taking a stand and breeding pugs with a longer snout. Health is most important. Right now, I have one that a longer snout and longer legs. He doesn't have breathing issues and has unusually straight teeth for a pug. Not to mention he is drop dead gorgeous (silver boy). There is nothing to match the amazing personality of these little guys. Please, please continue in this direction for those of us who love them.FlipFlophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03870710502757621850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-64933456165931457162013-07-22T00:25:18.535+01:002013-07-22T00:25:18.535+01:00im so happy i found this i have had comments from ...im so happy i found this i have had comments from so many people saying my pug is not pure breed because his nose is not flat but knowing that he is able to breathe so much better makes me a lot more happier and i dont really care if it makes him show worthy or not as long as he is healthy is all i care about plus he looks so much better than alot of other pugs extremely handsome if i do say so myself amanda martinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-84776854625344632942013-02-04T16:18:55.054+00:002013-02-04T16:18:55.054+00:00Yeah, a little bit less deformed and slightly heal...Yeah, a little bit less deformed and slightly healthier :)Matushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17221540017270442165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-81898223224501644282012-11-24T18:34:24.234+00:002012-11-24T18:34:24.234+00:00I wrote to the Pug Dog Club, and they told me that...I wrote to the Pug Dog Club, and they told me that the Pug is not at risk from selective breeding! :SBethany Davieshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04572227333933921685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-48289067263284673862012-10-07T08:14:37.992+01:002012-10-07T08:14:37.992+01:00I'm glad that there are breeders like you out ...I'm glad that there are breeders like you out there who actually care about their dogs. I want to breed cavalier king charles spaniels without the brain and heart problems. I don't care if they aren't "show material" I just want to have happy healthy dogs and they are such lovely, cuddly and friendly dogs that it's a shame the breeders are being so careless for what they are doing to them. I have 2 rescue Cavaliers both with heart problems and they were bred from before j rescued them and i think it's awful<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-22506647572922173192011-03-07T21:41:40.802+00:002011-03-07T21:41:40.802+00:00@frogdog, thank you! My first thought when I saw t...@frogdog, thank you! My first thought when I saw this, and saw those KYOOOOOOT Pugs with muzzles, is "Now why cant there be frenchies like that!". I am going to check out your dogs and your blog. I see no reason why I cant have my cake and eat it too (healthy sound Frenchies with muzzles not from a BYB)WhatAmILookingAthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04018706550350738178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-79881275526933413872011-01-14T09:57:39.630+00:002011-01-14T09:57:39.630+00:00Does anyone know if there is anyone in the UK bree...Does anyone know if there is anyone in the UK breeding pugs with the longer muzzle? Or planning to do so?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-47025122115798233782010-12-15T08:33:52.523+00:002010-12-15T08:33:52.523+00:00Great to hear this, FrogDogz. Would love to see so...Great to hear this, FrogDogz. Would love to see some pix of your dogs.Jemima Harrisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05092892697145388048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-50856420761833523602010-12-15T03:54:46.170+00:002010-12-15T03:54:46.170+00:00As someone who breeds Frenchies, I've spent al...As someone who breeds Frenchies, I've spent almost twenty years intentionally breeding for a dog which has a longer face, open nares and normal palates. It CAN be done -- it can actually be done, and still produce a conformationally competitive dog.<br /><br />Step one, for breeders, is to simply say "NO". No to breeding from *or* to dogs who have had palate surgery, nares corrections or obviously laboured breathing. <br /><br />One of the things I remain most proud of is that, in 21 years of Frenchies, I have NEVER produced a dog which required a palate correction. <br /><br />Do my dogs have the countersunk face some breeders seem to find desirable? No, and thankfully, I have found that the majority of people within our breed (and ALL of the pet owners) will happily accept a longer face in exchange for a longer life span.<br /><br />Ditto tails - give me a Frenchie with a normal, waggy tail any day. Tails are part of our dogs spinal cords - they should not be twisted, inverted or non existant. Again, we can achieve this by being selective in what we breed from or to, and by not being afraid to do what's right for our dogs, even if it means less ribbons.FrogDogzhttp://www.bullmarketfrogs.com/blognoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-43284719783382969962010-12-08T07:58:01.246+00:002010-12-08T07:58:01.246+00:00To see just how the pug has changed over the years...To see just how the pug has changed over the years and the potential problems that these changes can cause, watch this<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wz0mJW_LKsU<br /><br />It's quite long so grab a cup of tea!Kate Pricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12984661154425549615noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-34925545581390975042010-12-07T22:05:10.541+00:002010-12-07T22:05:10.541+00:00I thought this post brilliant, at last a picture o...I thought this post brilliant, at last a picture of what a good pug can look like. With the added advantage of much better eyes too. They can still be recognised as a pug and no other breed. Yet again it's the independants who are blazing the way and show what can actually be done if there is enough genuine desire to do so.<br />As for the previous comment - comparing the tail curl of such dogs a basenji and spitz types, with the pug, proposterous!<br />Great Blog!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1183957703077342201.post-91771670167625327312010-12-07T10:43:55.249+00:002010-12-07T10:43:55.249+00:00Who knows, as many cases in pugs and frenchies are...Who knows, as many cases in pugs and frenchies are found incidentally on radiograph, and some dogs carrying the defect never show clinical signs, or show them later in life.<br />I have seen one documented case in a basenji puppy. As for malamutes, I wouldn't say their tails were particularly curled tightly over the back plus they have much longer legs and a longer body. Poms also do not have a required tightly curled tail, and their tails are longer?<br />The clear difference to me is that the breeds that suffer with the problem in high numbers all have brachy faces, short spines, stocky bodies, and highly deformed tail vertebra if any at all.Kate Pricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12984661154425549615noreply@blogger.com